Metroid Prime - Beach Volleyball

[Cpt.Glitch]

Very inspirational post RealRed. 

[Mayo-chan]

And, why are you waiting around for this big fatcat shitty corporation to make some dated formula with shiny new paint type game you can pay money for and feel disappointed for buying? This is like disrespect to those of us who spend shitloads of hours making new metroid levels, codes, designs, and graphics for you to play. Fuck you.

Ayyy, that ain't nice. I thought we were like family :(

Anyway, I think this game still has a chance at being at least somewhat competent by release. I was thinking a lot about this game earlier and for the most part the reason everyone's pissed at the game is because of its aesthetics. This isn't the first time a Nintendo game from one of its main franchises had major backlash, The Wind Waker back in 2002 pissed off loads of people for looking like something that appealed to 4-year-olds. Nowadays everyone says Wind Waker is one of the best Zelda games in the series, and while I certainly can't say this will be held as high because of the style of gameplay MPFF has alone, I think this game has potential for surprises to be held. The mission based structure can be surprisingly good at telling a subtle narrative, and it would be really cool if the game took surprisingly dark twists as you progress towards the end and go through heavier moral delimnas. Even more so if the game keeps its cutesy looks and attitude; this is actually a game about glorifying the Galactic Federation, and making dangerous and harmful things like bioweapons look like fun things to use. One mission early on could be about destroying space pirate drop ships, than much later in the game you could be stealing metroids from space pirates and delivering them to GF headquarters for testing. In the end we could have a game that expands the Metroid universe in a way we would never learn with Samus, or I could be a big fat retard when the game comes out and the entire thing is just shooting aliens with friends.

...that is, if I can find other people to play it with me.

EDIT:

So in this interview:
http://mynintendonews.com/2015/06/17/samus-will-make-an-appearance-in-metroid-prime-federation-force-producer-tanabe-reveals/

There's gonna be like 30 missions, and 1 will feature Metroids.
I can't imagine that being any amount of satisfying.

[RT-55J]

I remember back before we had much info on Hunters that people were open to the idea of it having a mission-based structure like this. And, iirc, the original idea behind Corruption was of a mission-based thing with Samus doing, like, actual bounty hunting for money. But Sakamoto or somebody vetoed that.

What I'm saying is that this silly idea has probably been a long time coming, but in terms of fanbase acceptance this is probably the worst possible time for them to make it.

[Xenesis]

Hunters also had the advantage of being released smack bang in the middle of three standard Metroid games, as opposed to at the end of a console generational length drought. People weren't concerned that the series was dead - it was very much alive, doing cool things and not crying in front of Ridley.

[Lunaria]

Metroid isn't really popular in Japan, and that's really the fanbase that nintendo aims to cater. This is why there's a new pokemon game every 6 months and a shitload of those special pokemon events are japanese exclusive every day.
Nintendo has realized that when you play favorites, you make money.
Now you guys just need to realize that you (metroid fans) are a minority in their eyes.

The problematic part about this perspective is that metroid has always been larger in the west than in Japan. Both in popularity and in sales.

This is the second time in row they are trying to take the series in a new direction in order to gain a larger fanbase in Japan. And it's the type of attitude that I see a lot in Japanese companies. For smaller companies, not even attempting to get your largest fanbase on board for a new title in a series could very well speak the end of the company. This move by Nintendo neither surprise me nor upsets me. (After all, if I want good new metroidvanias there are plenty in the indie scene.) But I do think it's terribly sad. The metroid series hold a special place in my heart, and it's not like Nintendo have been unable to make good titles in the past.

But honestly, I think this title is going to flop. The graphics looked terrible for a 3DS game, I mean, this is the reveal trailer. It's suppose to be impressive. Don't get me wrong, I prefer my trailers and pre-release material to accurate for the release product... but if this is what it's going to look like... well. As much as I don't particularly enjoy Hunters, that title at least looked good for the hardware it was on. (And it was released in the early in the DS lifespan, versus this that is released at the end of the 3DS' life span.) :<


Other M killed and buried Metroid, and now federational troopers are lap dancing on the grave. RIP in peace.

[Zero One]

And, why are you waiting around for this big fatcat shitty corporation to make some dated formula with shiny new paint type game you can pay money for and feel disappointed for buying? This is like disrespect to those of us who spend shitloads of hours making new metroid levels, codes, designs, and graphics for you to play. Fuck you.

Because I'd pick a decent Metroid game over a decent Metroid hack any day.

[Zhs2]

This is presuming that the original company can make decent Metroid games any more, a.k.a. Lunaria's post.

[Lazymoth]

I see lots of people complaining about this game, but no one saying exactly why it's bad or making a decent case for it.

It's not what I'd have in mind for a Metroid game but we don't know anything about it. Sure, I wanted exploration, I wanted some angst, I wanted Samus, but no one can say what surprises the game might hold. It might even have a lot of qualities that I fear it might not have. It might deliver well on those things. And whether or not it ticks the boxes- Other: M did, after all- doesn't mean it'll be good or not.

There's gonna be like 30 missions, and 1 will feature Metroids.
I can't imagine that being any amount of satisfying.

I mean, weighing the brief relevance of Metroids in Tourian against the entirety of Super Metroid, the ratio there would be pretty similar, right? Maybe a little bigger on the Metroids' side considering how tiny the game is, but I think for all intents and purposes, people who aren't speedrunning the game don't spend very long in Tourian compared to how long it takes to comfortably explore the rest. If you broke up Super Metroid into thirtieths, Metroids themselves would be relevant in few of them, especially as far as people playing it for the first time with no guide would be concerned.

Federation Force might not look much like Metroid as we know it- aside from its very Retro Studios HUD- but that doesn't mean it won't invoke any Metroid feelings. It could be a good Metroid game even if it didn't have any Metroids or Samus. Playing as Samus in Metroid nor even fighting the eponymous creatures has any bearing on the style of gameplay from a technical standpoint. With regards to its atmosphere? Sure, that's subjective. But I think we really need to keep an open mind.

I don't think it's fair to say the Metroid franchise is dead. Other: M was terrible, but why should that mean Metroid is dead? It was just the work of one company.

So many people are naming off "they," some nebulous entity responsible for Metroid's downfall, but who are they? Is it Nintendo? Because Nintendo just owns the IP. Many of its games are made by vastly different companies. If it comes to pass that Federation Force is a bad game, it wouldn't be Nintendo's fault, it would be Next Level Games's fault. In this situation, Next Level Games is they and they have not made a Metroid game before. They're also not responsible for the trainwreck that was Other: M, so I think people should at least be relieved about that.

What we can do to most accurately forecast how good this game could be is to just go look at what they've done. I love Dark Moon. Though it took up a mission-based structure I still found it adequately exploratory, not to mention beautiful and well-made. Also, its co-op multiplayer was really fun and interesting, so with an apparent focus on multiplayer I think it's safe to say Federation Force will be even better on that front.

They've also made a lot of sports games, so I guess that explains Blast Ball. Also Ghost Recon was a catastrophe, but after how good Dark Moon was, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and just wait and see here with Federation Force.

Maybe most importantly, this isn't all serious business like so many ridiculous "fans" are acting like it is.

Honestly, seeing the reaction to this game, like people organizing a Change.org petition to plead for its cancellation- a site mostly intended for real-world issues of actual importance- it's really fucking embarrassing. RT really nailed it.

silly amounts of apoplectic nerd rage

e: for brevity. Also toned down a bit of my own apoplectic nerd rage induced from seeing the Change.org petition.

[Xenesis]

It could be the best Chibi-Soccer FPS game ever (and NLG are good, so there's chances it will be decent at worst), but that doesn't a Metroid game make.

Luigi's Mansion in particular also didn't have much of a long history or pedigree either - they essentially made a full-sized game out of what was essentially a fairly big GCN tech demo. They also didn't really throw out the entire convention of the GCN game with that - it was still mostly about Luigi wandering around a haunted mansion hunting ghosts and solving puzzles.

[Zhs2]

Sports games are always eh.

Also, Dark Moon really should have just been one continuous experience - that's what made the first great, imo. Dark Moon was just... average. Going back to previous levels is more of an annoyance than a freely explorable trait of the game, something Luigi's Mansion made accessible - although, there wasn't any reason to backtrack unless you missed something.

[Scooterboot9697]

I say we shouldn't judge a book by its cover. I'm willing to give it a go.
The only reasonable problem I have with this game, is that I currently don't own a 3DS. :lol:

[A Dummy]

I'm in agreement, we'll see how it turns out. Personally, I was wanting a game that talks more about the Federation, but I still want a REAL Metroid game at some point. (Like how Link between Worlds was the perfect throwback game the wasn't just a copy/paste of the original one.)

What's funny about Other M, is I figured out that all you need to do to fix it is instead of playing as Samus, you should just play as a Federation Squad Private (Even let her still be female.) and suddenly it makes way more sense why she would be so concerned with gaining the respect and trust of her commanding officer. And why she seemed to get 6 inches shorter. XD (Maybe even have her be someone who is trained in the use of a new Federation Power armor prototype so game play stays the same.) Because I think when it comes down to it, Other M's biggest problem was Team Ninja messing with Samus's character.

[Mtgxyz]

is this thread a happy-birthday-thread for Godwin's law?

Nevermind. This game looks shit and most likely is shit.

hey. It could be the worst spin-off of every game. Let's call it "Call of the Federation Force" or "Federation Force eleven (or four)". I would only buy this game, if the number of missions is at lease three times more than planned. Ah and they have to drop the "Metroid prime" in the title and make the Metroids and Samus as easter eggs. and the graphics. Already seen better in other 3DS games. I know, that it would be easier to cancel it than to fit my needs. but the newest metroid title I can play on my devices is Metroid: Zero mission. Exactly. And even if I would have a GC or Wii, my parents would probably not allow me to play FPS-games, even though they're rated 12/12/16. (Yes corruption is rated 16 in germany. And Trilogy's too. fuck the persons rating the games) I don't know about other M's rating though.  also my parents threw tantrums, when they saw, that I tried to play metroid prime on my PC. Was shit anyways because my pc is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar to slow to play it.

PS: Before you ask me, why I don't have a stationary console, here's the answer:
My Mum and Bro are seemingly living watching TV, because of them the TV runs all the time. And it doesn't make any sense to play only when neither of both are using it. It only is like 30 mins/day.

[Lunaria]

I see lots of people complaining about this game, but no one saying exactly why it's bad or making a decent case for it.

I think I already pointed out a fair bit of issues, but sure, let me go into detail:

1. The graphics are terrible by 3DS standard.
2. Online play has not been announced yet for it as far as I know. If this title does not have online play, then it will be fairly garbage outside of Japan.
3. The target demographic of the title is luckwarm for the metroid brand, at best.
4. Even though the game comes packed in with a ball game mode, it still seem to be very lacking in content. (Based on what we know so far.)
5. Probably New 3DS only. Even if it's not forced, playing FPS games on a DS system is less than ideal. You'd need that extra stick/nub. This means that the install base for this heavily multiplayer based title will probably be significantly smaller than what it could be. (There are still many who are quite MEH about picking up the NEW 3DS.) This in turns means it will be harder to get people to play with. (Combine this with a lack of online (assuming it does not have that) and you have almost a guaranteed flop.)


Let me put it this way: Even if this title didn't have the metroid name, I'd still consider it bad and not pick it up. Because it frankly seem to have quite a bit of flaws. Heck, even if I do pick it up, I doubt I'd have anyone to play with at all if it's local only. I'm the first to say that I don't care much about graphics, but I honestly do expect to be able to see a difference between a 3DS (New 3DS even, most likely.) game and a DS one.

It's not what I'd have in mind for a Metroid game but we don't know anything about it. Sure, I wanted exploration, I wanted some angst, I wanted Samus, but no one can say what surprises the game might hold.

Actually, we know a fair bit about it. We don't know everything, but that's not the same as we don't know anything. Based on the amount of content they showed, It'd surprise me greatly if this has some major stuff that we couldn't expect.

I think it's understandable why people are upset, it's the first title with the metroid name in quite many years, and it's a side game that is quite different. If there were other metroid games announced or released more recently, I think the fanbase would simply not give a damn. After all, this game is not even made for the metroid fanbase. It's made to gain more interest for the metroid brand in Japan. (Much like Other M tried to, and failed at doing.)

Federation Force might not look much like Metroid as we know it- aside from its very Retro Studios HUD- but that doesn't mean it won't invoke any Metroid feelings. It could be a good Metroid game even if it didn't have any Metroids or Samus. Playing as Samus in Metroid nor even fighting the eponymous creatures has any bearing on the style of gameplay from a technical standpoint. With regards to its atmosphere? Sure, that's subjective. But I think we really need to keep an open mind.

I honestly don't think many here gives a damn about playing as Samus necessarily. A game in the metroid universe where you play as a federation trooper or another hunter could work very well. However, it's quite obvious that the gameplay isn't there in this title. The running and shooting, that is to say, the FPS stuff, isn't what made the prime games gameplay. This game is metroid in thematics, and arguably perspective, only.

Also, I'd like to point out that arguing that this game will bring out metroid style feelings is quite dense. As the title lacks any and all of the things that have made the metroid games feel the way they do.

1. You don't explore the world.
2. You aren't alone.
3. The immersion in the character and world is lower as a result of the game being co-op with other players.
etc.

The original metroid was inspired by Aliens. That sort of horror wibe that the metroid games have adapted is present in almost all, if not all, metroid titles. But I can't imagine it would be possible to recreate that in a mission based structure combined with co-op gameplay. (Even other M managed to capture this aspect.)

I don't think it's fair to say the Metroid franchise is dead. Other: M was terrible, but why should that mean Metroid is dead? It was just the work of one company.

I don't think people are overtly serious with the statement. Nintendo will keep using the brand until it stops being profitable. It's not uncalled for though, as nintendo themselves has not made a proper metroid title since ZM/Prime 3/trilogy. Other M was quite different, and I'd honestly not group it in the metroidvania genre, as that's not the type of gameplay at shown. It was closer of a puzzle title/interactive movie if you ask me.

So many people are naming off "they," some nebulous entity responsible for Metroid's downfall, but who are they? Is it Nintendo? Because Nintendo just owns the IP. Many of its games are made by vastly different companies. If it comes to pass that Federation Force is a bad game, it wouldn't be Nintendo's fault, it would be Next Level Games's fault. In this situation, Next Level Games is they and they have not made a Metroid game before. They're also not responsible for the trainwreck that was Other: M, so I think people should at least be relieved about that.

Please don't make moronic statements like this. As the sole owner of an IP, Nintendo has complete control over how it's used. And I'd also like to point out that any third party game made under the IP have been under order and in collaboration with Nintendo. They have full executive control. They may not have been the company who made the assets for any one given title, but they sure as hell was part in the deciding part of what should be done. (And they could cancel any given project at any given time, etc.)

[Lazymoth]

1. The graphics are terrible by 3DS standard.
2. Online play has not been announced yet for it as far as I know. If this title does not have online play, then it will be fairly garbage outside of Japan.

As far as the graphics go, yeah they don't look great. Dark Moon is a beautiful game though, so maybe it'll look less rough when it's further along. Dark Moon had online multiplayer. Seeing as this is NLG, it will definitely have an online component. I don't think it'll be garbage, Dark Moon and RE:Revelations (not NLG, but relevant as an action shooter with servers presumably stationed in japan) multiplayer were pretty perfect for me and I don't have a very good connection.

4. Even though the game comes packed in with a ball game mode, it still seem to be very lacking in content. (Based on what we know so far.)
5. Probably New 3DS only. Even if it's not forced, playing FPS games on a DS system is less than ideal. You'd need that extra stick/nub. This means that the install base for this heavily multiplayer based title will probably be significantly smaller than what it could be. (There are still many who are quite MEH about picking up the NEW 3DS.) This in turns means it will be harder to get people to play with. (Combine this with a lack of online (assuming it does not have that) and you have almost a guaranteed flop.)

To briefly address the first point here, going off of Dark Moon we can expect a fair amount of feature creep. Regarding whether or not it's on the New 3DS, I would assume it's not. Half a year ago New 3DS units accounted for only 3.65% of 3DS systems purchased. It's surely a couple ticks higher by now, but I still think Nintendo would want their important releases more widely accessible. If it is on New 3DS, I know I certainly won't be buying it either, and the poor graphic quality would be really mysterious (a big hint that it's on normal 3DS, imo.)

I'm pretty sure it's not going to try and excel as a traditional twin-stick FPS, especially going by what we saw of Blast Ball at NWC, but instead it will be heavily lock-on / circle-strafe centric like the original Prime, which didn't make use of a second stick for aiming. If it were a twin-stick FPS, why would there be such an excessive amount of z-targeting present in what we've seen?

1. You don't explore the world.
2. You aren't alone.
3. The immersion in the character and world is lower as a result of the game being co-op with other players.
etc.

The original metroid was inspired by Aliens. That sort of horror wibe that the metroid games have adapted is present in almost all, if not all, metroid titles. But I can't imagine it would be possible to recreate that in a mission based structure combined with co-op gameplay.

I'm glad to see an attempt at corroborating the tangible components of what makes a proper Metroid experience. That does explain the cognitive dissonance experienced by seeing all the lighthearted antics being slapped into a game with the Metroid title. Tonally speaking, yes, this game is clearly making no efforts of providing isolation and desperation.

But I would definitely argue that a game can still feel open and exploratory in spite of being mission-based and co-op; I suppose time will tell if this game will manage that. Peoples' mileage will vary, but Dark Moon's missions tickled me as adequately exploratory, so I think it's fair to say there's a real chance that NLG could do a good job.

Please don't make moronic statements like this. As the sole owner of an IP, Nintendo has complete control over how it's used. And I'd also like to point out that any third party game made under the IP have been under order and in collaboration with Nintendo. They have full executive control. They may not have been the company who made the assets for any one given title, but they sure as hell was part in the deciding part of what should be done. (And they could cancel any given project at any given time, etc.)

Yes, obviously Nintendo has complete control over their property, I wasn't saying they didn't. But the company handling production is still very responsible for whether the game is good or not, no matter what specifications Nintendo has them follow. I don't think it's moronic at all to say that Federation Force's quality is NLG's responsibility, just as Retro Studios were responsible for Prime and DKCR being good, and, say, Tose is responsible for Super Princess Peach being a bore. Nintendo may say what should be done, but anything could be done well. It falls on the contracted company to try and do well with what they're asked.

"Dense," "moronic," why so incisive? :( If it wasn't clear, my outrage wasn't directed at people in this topic, but rather the kind of people who would organize and sign that ridiculous petition. Sorry if I came off as condescending or anything.

[Narpas Sword]

It could be the best game in the world. I still want a proper Metroid. You know...about exploration.  :twisted: