Metroid: Mechanical Flower

[Flower]

Hey Guys,

I'm totally new to Hacking. I found Metroid to be a good Game to edit.
First of all, Thanks snarfblam! for the wonderful Editroid! It gives me a hook to Hacking without having to deal with hexadecimal asm stuff. Though it's not perfect in drag and drop aspects, it's a fine tool to get started with. Everything else more complicated rather stole my motivation in doing Hacks.

So i just began to hack my own Metroid 1 Adventure. The working title is, as you may have guessed Mechanical Flower. I want to give Zebes a more natural and cavelike look, rather than 1986's flat look. I used snarfblam's save/map/icewave - patch in advance. For the Beginning i find it too hard and time consuming to draw my own tiles, though it would give it a more personal touch.
I just wanted to begin designing levels. So up until now i did much level painting, trying and testing the new environment, dealing with several problems (palette swap stole my mind for example) and thinking of how the game is gonna look when it's finally finished.

I began in September 1st and spent much time on it.
Brinstar is more or less finished (it was just after 5 days), so I believe the whole thing gonna get finished soon.  :^_^:


For some loose first impressions a few pics of the Beginning of Brinstar (yet more to come!)












P.S.: snarfblam, are you still active here for possible questions and troubleshooting? Is Editroid gonna get more updates?
-> EDIT: OK scrolling through the last topics and threads i find this question to be obsolete.

Oh here's another pic of one of my favourite rooms so far (Cavelike-Room with Missiles in Norfair):




For people interested I offer the ips-patch of the progress until now. The ones who don't want to spoil the experience as a whole, wait for the final game; everyone else: Have Fun! ;)
Of course, the complete final game is gonna look different. For example, all those missiles lying around in certain areas for testing purposes, don't expect them being there later on.  :eyeroll: (i used snarfblam's patch, thus am unable to use the test room-feature)
=> I am curious about suggestions, feedback, hints and tipps. Like i said, this is my very first hacking attempt!

Snarfblam respectively, please watch the hack. Problems i totally am unable to fix:

• Why are the graphics glitching when you use the Elevator Norfair->Brinstar?
• Why are some of the dragons in Norfair NOT spitting out Fire?
• Why are some combos/Structures not drawn in the palette/color i want them to (they even change when i re-enter the certain rooms)?

Everyone:

• Is it possible to enable missile-refills? ('cause farming missiles can get very tedious.)  :<_<:
• Is there an easy way to edit the amount of missiles you get from beating bosses? (no i don't have any asm skills yet!)

Greetz and Thanks, yours Flower!

[Grimlock]

Welcome to metroid construction.  :cool:

It's good to see another Metroid hack in progress.  Being as this is your first project you should really look at it as a learning tool.  Try to push and challenge yourself.  I would strongly encourage you to work in some custom graphics and music.  There is a music editing app known as Metroid Tuner that's actually pretty easy too use once you learn how to use it.  For graphics I personally (mainly) use Tile Layer Pro, and Tile Molester.  I have used photoshop and YYCHR but I found using TLP simple and strait forward enough for most of the work.  Tile Molester is great for copying large sections of tiles as well as a few other features that come in handy from time to time.

Once you finish your first hack (your learning tool) you'll be in great shape to create something lasting and memorable.  If you have any questions post them here and I'll answer what I can.

A couple tips (since you asked):

I recommend against working on ROMS that are already patched, best case you can't use the test room feature.  Worst case the rom is broken after you edit X, Y, or Z.  The test room feature is a great tool, I would start with a clean ROM and apply Snarfblam's save game/map patch as a final step before release.  There is a version of the patch that will work for edited ROMs, I know because I used it on my Metroid Incursion project after I finished it.


If you create custom graphics you need to create them before you construct your area, doing it after will most likely have you redoing and modifying your structure layout.

Music can be added any time, read the available tutorials and try the example song tracks.

If you want to use vanilla M1 tiles you should at the very least create a few custom tiles to make make your structures make sense (I'll post an example image later).

Most experienced ROM hackers recognize that this is your first project so don't take it personal if no one offers to assist you directly on your project.  We're all limited in our person time availability and usually have our own projects to work on.  Also most first time hackers never complete their hack, they usually get burnt out on it or their interests drift.


Why are the graphics glitching when you use the Elevator Norfair->Brinstar?
You didn't offer much information here but I imagine you added tiles to the black screen with the elevator tube, when the graphics cycle to the new bank they load the tiles with the same HEX value from the loaded bank.  More details later as my tablet battery is about to die.


Why are some of the dragons in Norfair NOT spitting out Fire?
This is probably a sprite slot issue.

Why are some combos/Structures not drawn in the palette/color i want them to (they even change when i re-enter the certain rooms)?
This is a well know bug in the game engine, when you are falling sometimes the palettes get messed up.

Let me know if you have anymore questions.

[Grimlock]

I think you have the right intentions with what you are trying to accomplish with your more natural looking curvature of the rooms you are creating.  I think you would benefit from some new structures and basic graphics edits.  You can expand on the original graphics set and add a few more angled ceiling tiles for example.  I was originally going to draft up an image with some examples and recommendations but I decided to go a little further for you and the other recently announced hacks.  I'm writing up a basic graphics editing tutorial that focuses on Tile Layer Pro.  I should have it done tomorrow, hopefully you guys will find it helpful.

[Flower]

Hello again,

i was a bit frustrated, cause my last approach of the hack went glitching and i have no real clue why.

But i think i gonna try once more, motivation! ;)

Cheers

[Flower]

Grimlock, if you would have the patience to test my hack, and tell me what in sum i have done wrong, (and maybe some general advices) i would be very appreciated. Thanks!

[snarfblam]

i was a bit frustrated, cause my last approach of the hack went glitching and i have no real clue why.

If you aren't doing this already, make sure you make frequent backups. That way if you run into a problem you can go back and figure out exactly where things went wrong and, at the same time, minimize lost work.

[Grimlock]

Grimlock, if you would have the patience to test my hack, and tell me what in sum i have done wrong, (and maybe some general advices) i would be very appreciated. Thanks!

I wish I had time right now.  I'm in the middle of a move that's going to have me pretty tied up for the next month.  We're in the initial play testing phase with the Rogue Dawn hack so whatever free tiime I have during the next few weeks will probably go to weeding out issues people have been finding.  I'll have a look when I can but you'll have to be patient with me cause it'll probably be several weeks out.

[Flower]

Hello,

I am doin' a complete re-work of my hack.
An Issue i have:
Is there any way to get either the combinedblocks.ips or the Code under HealthBlocks running for an expanded ROM?
The Game is instantly crashing as soon as it starts. But i don't want to hack an unexpanded ROM (where the hack actually is working).
I would also like to include some more asm-Hacks (Door Transition speed, Not Getting hurt from enemies while passing through a door, walljumping, ...).

What are your experiences in doing so, do you think it is possible?

I wish I had time right now.  I'm in the middle of a move that's going to have me pretty tied up for the next month.  We're in the initial play testing phase with the Rogue Dawn hack so whatever free tiime I have during the next few weeks will probably go to weeding out issues people have been finding.  I'll have a look when I can but you'll have to be patient with me cause it'll probably be several weeks out.

I can unterstand, furthermore you are very busy I guess with your Rogue Dawn-Project.

If you aren't doing this already, make sure you make frequent backups. That way if you run into a problem you can go back and figure out exactly where things went wrong and, at the same time, minimize lost work.

Thanks for thee advice, yes I do high frequent Backups, nearly after every step of change.

Thanks and Greets! =)

[Flower]

Hey People, I got a new Approach going.

Parts of the new Progress is shown in the Pictures down below.

Comments, Critics and Feedback of all kinds are welcome.

Cheers.  :cool:

       

[SChase123]

Man, I wish I were you.
I would've been able to focus on one project.

[Physix]

Man, I wish I were you.
I would've been able to focus on one project.

If you want to focus on one project, nobody is stopping you but you.

You lack the skills necessary to take on an overly ambitious project, and there's no shame in that. We all had to start somewhere. I didn't even know how to copy paste back when I installed my first version of Game Maker, so I literally copied Samus's sprites pixel by pixel in that old, choppy image editor.

Don't try to get into the scene by starting out with Metroid style fangames. Metroid requires an immense amount of experience to get right, as there are a lot of moving parts that interact with one another. For the most bare-bone of Metroid games you'd have to program in fancy door transitions, a minimap, energy tanks, enemies, ice beam freezing said enemies, water physics, moving platforms, item pickups, lots of HUD elements, a subscreen, save stations... ... The list never ends. It's best to start out with something less demanding.

In terms of sticking to one project, Iji is a good example of a game that requires barely any programming knowledge to understand.

http://www.remar.se/daniel/iji.php

The source code is available for download on that website. It's a huge project. It took Daniel nearly 5 years to make the first few releases. Upon closer inspection, however, the inner workings of the game are nothing fancy. It's just simple, easy-to-follow code that gets the job done. There's just so much of it. It doesn't take a programming genius to make a game; it takes an idea and lots of passion. Get yourself an idea and just stick with it. Build your own world, write your own story. It can be an hour-long project, or it can be a year-long project. What matters is that you go through with it. Even if the end result is total shit, at least you'd have learned from your experiences.

[samplerInfo]

Don't try to get into the scene by starting out with Metroid style fangames. Metroid requires an immense amount of experience to get right, as there are a lot of moving parts that interact with one another.

Hear, hear.

It's one thing trying to get a small add-on hack to work, or getting a couple of your own sprites into the game. Those are good exercises, definitely, although remember that the practical knowledge you acquire is often rather specific (which may also be a good experience). But making (and especially finishing) your own complete mod/hack.. :eyeroll:

There are so many better ways to start.
And then return :twisted:

[Flower]

...ok this wasn't the Feedback i was expecting, but hey!
I rather was expecting some specified Feedback about the Hack, i.e. the Pics i posted.

...Nevertheless:

Don't try to get into the scene by starting out with Metroid style fangames. Metroid requires an immense amount of experience to get right, as there are a lot of moving parts that interact with one another.

=> I learned a bit programming (JAVA and C, at some point i wrote a very basic JAVA game) and graphic editing (Photoshop,...), and it wasn't long ago that i played Metroid (and a few later titles) the very first time and was fascinated.
I like hacking it, and it is a good learning exercise. Editroid is one very fine Editor to work with!
So i guess it IS a good starting point.
But if you have some good suggestions for me, i wouldn't be disappointed! ;)
This point i got to recognize sooner as i wished:

there are a lot of moving parts that interact with one another

. Getting doors to work right, having tiles overlapped, issues with palette swap and many more difficulties. But Problems are there to get solved i guess. ;)

But making (and especially finishing) your own complete mod/hack

=> This is totally what i want to do!
In the meantime i got 2 friends excited from my hacking attempt, and they offered to help (with tile editing, composing new music for the game and beta-testing).

I get your advice to start with something easier and less complicated, but i got stuck on it, and don't want to stop. I got ideas, and also this great Forum.

I started a Hack last September which was the very first i ever did, and made many mistakes which i will avoid this time.

So please don't try to take away my enthusiasm  :bounce:

When i got more parts finished, i maybe will open a new thread for it, as this one here is obsolete, 'cause my old Mechanical Flower-Hack won't get finished, and i see the one as a whole new approach.

[samplerInfo]

...ok this wasn't the Feedback i was expecting, but hey!
I rather was expecting some specified Feedback about the Hack, i.e. the Pics i posted.

Hmm, I think you've confused Physix answer to SChase123, and my comment on that, with feedback targeted to you specifically. I can't speak for Physix, but my comment wasn't directed to anyone in particular. The advice is targeting people who for some reason believe hacking Metroid is an easy way to learn how games work, or how to mod a game in general, or get into programming, or get into the industry.

Anyway, I'd be happy too give you feedback. But I need a bit more than "I've got a new approach" to go on. Is it the art style/graphics you want feedback on?

I like hacking it, and it is a good learning exercise. Editroid is one very fine Editor to work with!
So i guess it IS a good starting point.

I think what both me and Physix are trying to say is that Metroid is neither the quickest nor the most optimal way to learn programming or getting into the gaming industry - if that's your goal. That is not the same as saying you shouldn't make hacks. It all depends on what your goals are.

I believe that anything that keeps you motivated is a good starting point. Problem is the keeping part, Metroid is notoriously bad at keeping people motivated. With projects in general it's easy to start and hard to see them through but at least the software isn't always working against you. With Metroid it's difficult to start, and then it gets more complicated the further you go - which is a killer to most people's motivation. The forums' slogan "Your're gonna need more than a hard hat." is very well suited.

That said, if you came to me looking for a job and had a completed hack of Metroid in your portfolio, it would definitely give you a heap of bonus points thanks to the above. Then again, the prerequisite is of course that I know what goes into Metroid hacking, whereas a lot of employers would probably frown at such a sample :wink:

I get your advice to start with something easier and less complicated, but i got stuck on it, and don't want to stop. I got ideas, and also this great Forum.

Again, it all depends on where you want to go and how you want to approach it. Please don't stop :^_^:

I started a Hack last September which was the very first i ever did, and made many mistakes which i will avoid this time.

So please don't try to take away my enthusiasm  :bounce:

That was never my intention!

[TheDruggedMetroid]

One of those rooms has lava that does nothing...

[RealRed]

I commend your use of red and green. Don't be afraid to use some contrast as well though, some black areas inside your tiles will do wonders.

[Flower]

Thanks for your responds!

One of those rooms has lava that does nothing...

First, thanks for testing my very first hack (well more of a Brinstar Demo), yeah it's the little "sea" before the room with the bombs. It wasn't intended to behave like lava. More like just a harmless little lake.

I commend your use of red and green. Don't be afraid to use some contrast as well though, some black areas inside your tiles will do wonders.

Yeah, it's funny that you mention that, 'cause i DID experiment with black lines in my new tileset. Those tiles i posted were meant to look like mud or earth. I will include that in my latest hacking attempt which is on the make.
Well that is my third hack of metroid and i am hopeful it' s gonna get finished this time.

When i got something to show off (though i am not nearly as talented as Grimlock, this award goes to you!!) i will post that and i think in a new thread.

[Flower]

Development of this hack is stopped for the time being. I opened a new Thread for my new Hack. Take a look!