Top Hacks 2010 Discussion

[VideoGeemer]

I was thinking of tutorial that helps to do things you can't do before. Not the hack itself, but a tutorial. I forget about video walks. Maybe, separate category for tutorials and for video walks and 1 more for best person to consult. Don't sure.

Separate categoroes for totorials, video walkthroughs AND just people to consult? Seems like overkill to me.

VG

[JAM]

Separate categoroes for totorials, video walkthroughs AND just people to consult? Seems like overkill to me.

I will intend at least on first and third (maybe, mixed nomination) and on public patch. So many great, helpful tutorials and the winner can be only one.

Best new item sounds like a 'meh' IMO.

We don't have too many new items, that's true. Perhaps, it will be a good idea in 2011.

[personitis]

Personally, now that I think about things, I think this could work great if we kept maybe two or three (or four...) solid categories that we have every year. Other additional categories can be added as seen fit for each year without going over a certain limit.

As for category suggestions, I don't believe we have a Hack with Best Exploration according to the topic in the Contests forum. ;D

[Lunaria]

Personally, now that I think about things, I think this could work great if we kept maybe two or three (or four...) solid categories that we have every year. Other additional categories can be added as seen fit for each year without going over a certain limit.

As for category suggestions, I don't believe we have a Hack with Best Exploration according to the topic in the Contests forum. ;D

I know this seam like a bit odd for me to drive this... but this category REALLY needs to be added. I'm sure I'm not the only one burning for heavy exploration based hacks... therefor it would be nice to have it as an award too.

[MetroidMst]

Best exploration is a must.
Story could be added sometime, but I don't think this is a good year for it.
Best new item could be done in some years.
(These two being added only when over half of the full hacks up for awards meet said criteria.)

What about most polished hack? Fact is every who does a hack puts a ton of hours into it, but some are crazy about every detail being perfect. Maybe recognize them for the extra work they put upon themselves for our benefit.

[personitis]

The way 'polished' was described makes it seem like another aesthetics category. When you say most polished I think 'least amount of bugs and mistakes.' Also at the note on adding categories, this is why I propose we set some many categories a year and only certain ones a year because obviously we can't meet every category every year with enough (or fair) competition. In addition, would we count the seasonal hacks (i.e. Halloween contest hacks) as short hacks eligible in the TH '10?

[MetroidMst]

They are hacks so yes, I would count them as well.

[Quietus]

I'm inclined to think that we're heading toward too many categories already.  I think we're better off keeping it simple.  Best full, half, mini, and one-room hacks (if available), along with things like best (meaning most helpful) coder / hacker / whatever.

[Lunaria]

* Best Aesthetics - The one hack that is so beautiful to look at it makes you cry
    * Most Creative Gameplay - The one hack that makes use of the most creative concept ever implemented to enhance gameplay in some form
    * Best Quick Play - The one hack that is satisfying and short at the same time
    * Best Challenge - The one hack that plays difficult time and time again, and yet keeps you coming back for more
    * Most Anticipated - The one Work In Progress that makes you squee your pants when you watch the trailers
    * Worst Hack (as needed!) - The one hack that just really stank and didn't do much else
    * Best Overall - The one hack that outshines all of the others... which will it be?

If we add in every category suggested in this thread, it would be way too many, just like Quietus said.

Further more, I have really not seen any WORTHWHILE category to add beside best exploration.


The reason for that is quite simple: If you read the title it says "Top Hacks 2010" it should be quite simple to see that it's hacks we are looking for here, not the best hacker, coder or the best guide!
Even more so, it needs to be a category in which most hacks can be entered in as seen fit by the players. If you look at the categories up there (that I quoted for you) you should clearly be able to tell that a hack such as mine, ice metal could win any and all of those awards based on how the player feel about it. On the other hand, a mini hack that may only be 20-30 rooms could also win all of those awards.

My point is, the categories needs to fit the formula that any hack could win any one of them. Of course some hacks are more prone to win certain awards then others based on how they are designed, but that does not change the fact that the player may not feel that way.


Which brings me to the point where it's a good idea to have best exploration! Every metroid have exploration, some more then others *coughfusionothermcough*, therefor, anyone who designing a metroid hack, would most likely have exploration in some form or another.
While it's true that one could design a hack that is pure linear without any exploration, it's quite hard. Most boss rush hacks I have seen have had exploration based parts in them too, even though it may be limited.

While it may seam egoistic of me to drive this due to me marketing my hack as next to pure exploration, that does not change the fact that most (of not all, I have not played all) hacks this year have exploration. And it's also up to the players to judge what type of exploration they like the most, and how well the hacker designed the exploration aspects.



I'm not against suggesting more categories, and I certainly would like to see more of them in order to lift forward every aspect of the hack. But one would have to think of a category that would be realistic and non-limiting to have. Best action may or may not be one such thing too.

I'm not against having top guides or top/most helpful users for "insert X year here" but one could keep that separately from top hacks, as it's not the same thing.

I hope this post makes it more clear where I stand, and further more I hope people understand this point of view, and most of all I hope zeke adds best exploration as a category! :D!:

[Quietus]

I understand a lot of what you've said, but I still think it feels a little superfluous to what we already have.  The title of 'Best Hack' is ultimately going to be down to the players.  The players all enjoy hacks for a number of different reasons, and I think that a general 'Best Hack' title encompasses these tastes.  Having 'Best Exploration' only opens the door for 'Best Puzzles' and the like, which only adds more categories again.

[Lunaria]

I get what you're saying, but we already have best Aesthetics, should we remove that too and pack it with best overall?
As the way you're getting at it, that should too fall under it.

It just comes down to what people want and what Zeke feels like running, really.

[MetroidMst]

More than that, exploration is an important part to any Metroid game, more so than aesthetics. So if it gets to be too many categories, you could drop that one, which tends to favor a select few very talented tilers over those of us less gifted in that area but make relatively good and comparable hacks exploration-wise.

[Lunaria]

Aesthetics is more then just that MetroidMst, one could make a really huge WOW impression on people with an area without fancy tiling, you just need to be creative. But you do have a few points.

[personitis]

Having 'Best Exploration' only opens the door for 'Best Puzzles' and the like, which only adds more categories again.

In addition to what Crys and MetroidMst have said, exploration is not only an important part of Metroid as a whole, but taking the above quote anyone should know that 'Exploration' is the parent group of things like 'best puzzle,' 'best world progression,' etc. etc. And Crys, I'll have to add in addition to "Best Exploration" a "Best Vanilla Hack" for the sake of getting the newbies around here involved as well. Though everything else you said Crys, I can see your ground and I'll stand with you on that. Too many categories is just too much.

And just cause I can suggest another category, I will: Most Original Hack.
:D

[JAM]

Too many categories is just too much.

Then, what if just make a poll for each new category listed here if Zhs2 will agree with it? If most people say "yes" in each certain case, include it.

[Digital_Mantra]

tl;dr

cut out the worst hack and most anticipated. those are useless categories.
fill those 2 in with something better. like exploration and whatever the fuck else.

[Lunaria]

tl;dr

cut out the worst hack and most anticipated. those are useless categories.
fill those 2 in with something better. like exploration and whatever the fuck else.

^ this post strike some very good points!

[Zhs2]

tl;dr

cut out the worst hack and most anticipated. those are useless categories.
fill those 2 in with something better. like exploration and whatever the fuck else.

I quite agree with cutting most anticipated... It doesn't really win any official merit and could probably be integrated with the conclusion of TopHacks or something. We're probably not going to cut away Worst, though, although it doesn't have to be done every single year - just if there's a hack so bad or so infamous that it deserves a recognition of its own, something Samus-Aran's plagiarism boss rushes definitely deserved last year. <_<

Best Exploration sounds like a cool category, though.

[RealRed]

shit all sux

[Katelyn]

shit all sux

I agree

[Lunaria]

I think demos falls in under WIPs though, as it's not the done product.

But then again, I could be wrong. Regardless, it would be nice if this could be cleared up.

[Quietus]

I'd suggest that it shouldn't be accepted, on the grounds that it's not the completed hack intended for public release.  If we consider allowing incomplete (for one reason of another) hacks, we could open the door for every unfinished project ever, which, if we include everybody, is going to be a looot of hacks. :^_^:

[Silver Skree]

Are demos going to be included, or only final releases?

Demos are valid as they are technically valid releases.

I was mainly asking if we could nominate our own works or if we have to have another member of the community nominate it for us.

[Zhs2]

I was mainly asking if we could nominate our own works or if we have to have another member of the community nominate it for us.

There is no rule stopping you from nominating your own works, although some people (read: Shadox) might frown at you for doing so. It's the vote afterwards that really determines the winner of said category, so feel free to nominate whichever it is you want.

I'd suggest that it shouldn't be accepted, on the grounds that it's not the completed hack intended for public release.  If we consider allowing incomplete (for one reason of another) hacks, we could open the door for every unfinished project ever, which, if we include everybody, is going to be a looot of hacks.

The argument for this is that even if said hacks are released/nominated unfinished-like, people will still be able to downvote it because of unpolished touches. Even if a creator decides that he wants to release a demo every year or something, people downvote that because it's the same stuff over and over again. Realistically, I don't think we're going to get TOO many hacks anyway... =P

[Lunaria]

My argument against demos is the fact that you can whip something up every year using the latest within hacking. Realistically, any long therm project will look outdated from whats on "the market" when it gets out so it really gives works uneven settings to be judged against.

Coming from me right now this must sound like a huge assholeish statement, but I would do it even if I did not have an entry.

Regardless of what people do, I'm never going to vote, in fact I'm going to vote against any demo I see. I dislike demos in general, not for the fact that they are bad, but due to them not being the final product. (But that's another topic entirely)