Hacks for VC

[Scyzer]

Making this topic cause I thought a convo that went on in IRC should be brought up for eveyone.

Anyway the idea was, that if we could get Nintendo involved with hacking in some way, we could have our bests hacks put up on Virtual Console for Wii to be downloaded and played by the entire world.

[spoiler=convo]

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03:34:05  <Grime>: Haha, I was pipe dreaming a little while ago.
03:34:15  <Multeblink>: night guys
03:34:16  <Grime>: About making a small SM hack team to create hacks for Nintendo to sell via VC.
03:34:18  <kando>: nn blink
03:34:25  <Multeblink>: seeya kando
03:34:34  <kando>: Grime: nintendo themselves might be open for that
03:34:39  <kando>: if someone presented it right
03:34:39  <HelloBot>: Hello, Silver_Skree ! ^.^
03:34:45  <Grime>: Yeah.
03:35:00  <kando>: people who dont know about hacks
03:35:04  <kando>: are really really missing out
03:35:10  <kando>: to replay your favorite games in a whole new adventure
03:35:17  <kando>: new physics, gameplay, maps, enemies
03:35:19  <kando>: anythign u can think of
03:35:20  <Grime>: We'd need a true showpiece hack, though. Something on or beyond Redesign's caliber to show them that it could very well be done.
03:35:39  <kando>: eris would be a good example
03:35:45  <kando>: if ppl can figure out they need to shoot the water
03:35:47  <kando>: at the beginning
03:35:48  <kando>: xD
03:36:23   * Aile huggles sadifish
03:36:26  <Sadiztyk>: Probably best to get something of Kej's
03:36:26  <Aile>: ^-^
03:36:32   * Sadiztyk hugs
03:36:48  <Sadiztyk>: but if Nintendo started releasing hacks for VC
03:36:53  <Sadiztyk>: that would be frakING epic
03:36:56  <kando>: that would be epic indeed.
03:36:58  <Sadiztyk>: like, fraking
03:37:05  <Sadiztyk>: lots and lots of fraking
03:37:07  <kando>: like a landmark.
03:37:11  <kando>: a breakthrough.
03:37:25  <kando>: they could sell it for 3 bucks even
03:37:29  <Grime>: Eris is a great hack in design and execution, but it would need a lot of fine-tuning if it was gonna be presented to Nintendo execs, and probably a lot of palette work.
03:37:40  <kando>: Grime: really palette work? :o
03:37:44  <Sadiztyk>: haha definietly a lot of palette work
03:37:48  <Grime>: Same goes for most all hacks, really. They'd need to be something that -felt- like an official continuation or branching from the original material.
03:37:54  <kando>: i should take a closer look :op
03:37:59  <Zhs2>: Sadiztyk: At least 4 guys in here are hoping that said fraking involves you XD
03:38:03  <Sadiztyk>: but i reckon SMR is good enough to showcase for nintendo
03:38:04  <kando>: yea grime, thats always the challenge
03:38:17  <Sadiztyk>: Zhs2, nah too many guys for me
03:38:29  <Grime>: Project Base might be something to consider after it was 100% done, even if it is the original game on crack.
03:38:38  <Sadiztyk>: needs to be less ghuys more girls ;)
03:38:43  <kando>: lol project base
03:38:48  <kando>: that quick boost
03:38:49  <Grime>: Temporus? Definitely not. Impulsion/Predator look promising in that regard, though.
03:38:50  <kando>: is lol
03:38:51  <kando>: xD
03:38:53  <Sadiztyk>: lol crack
03:39:03  <kando>: aegis if its ever released
03:39:08  <Sadiztyk>: Impulsion has so far to go though
03:39:10  <kando>: volta if its ever back on track
03:39:21  <kando>: volta demo is sexy
03:39:31  <Grime>: Volta is on an indeterminate hiatus because FP's been involved in Mario Bros. Wii hacking.
03:39:37  <kando>: ;_;
03:39:53  <Aile>: Nintendo needs to make original 8-bit games. Not just Capcom.
03:40:02  <Aile>: I wanna play a new 8-bit Mario game
03:40:04  <Aile>: x3
03:40:04  <kando>: yea thats all i play
03:40:05  <Grime>: I think he mentioned he might need other people to help him with things so he wouldn't have to shoulder it alone.
03:40:05  <kando>: on my psp
03:40:07  <kando>: retro console
03:40:08  <Grime>: Which I don't blame him for.
03:40:11  <Zhs2>: I'd like to see quite a few hacks that allow the use of Save Stations on VC
03:40:12  <kando>: genesis, snes, gb, gba, nes
03:40:17  <Zhs2>: Awesome shit.
03:40:17  <Grime>: When I start on my full hack, I'm gonna have people helping out for things here and there.
03:40:36  <Sadiztyk>: DSO's already helped me so much with my hack
03:40:38  <Grime>: Assuming we made a lil' SM hack troop for VC releases, what would we call ourselves!?
03:40:41  <Grime>: It would need to be something epic.
03:40:48  <Sadiztyk>: MetConst?
03:40:50  <Sadiztyk>: lolol
03:40:53  <interdpth>: <Sadiztyk> MetConst?
03:40:54  <kando>: MetCon team
03:41:03  <Zhs2>: <interdpth> <Sadiztyk> MetConst?
03:41:05  <kando>: Team MetCom
03:41:05  <Grime>: So you'd see it on the "NINTENDO" logo. Like, the NINTENDO logo, then underneath it "and [name] presents"
03:41:06  <kando>: er
03:41:07  <kando>: Team MetCon
03:41:08  <Grime>: Or sum'n.
03:41:14   * Aile cuddles Antidote.
03:41:14  <kando>: i could see that in
03:41:16  <Aile>: <3
03:41:16  <kando>: credits
03:41:23  <kando>: like Team Starfox
03:41:25  <Zhs2>: MetroidConstruction is an epic name
03:41:45  <Zhs2>: Probably because it involves the word "Metroid"
03:41:46  <Sadiztyk>: well now I think about it, if we had nintendo's support for hacks, imagine just how much they know about the game
03:41:48  <Grime>: Or if we had like 4 members, the group could be called "MetCon 4"
03:41:51  <Grime>: So we'd sound badass.
03:41:53  <Grime>: Like the four horsemen.
03:41:54  <Zhs2>: haha
03:41:56  <Sadiztyk>: we could have EVERYTHING documented
03:42:02  <Zhs2>: Dude
03:42:04  <kando>: they need to comprehend that this community has changed the entire fraking game
03:42:06   * Antidote hugs Aile
03:42:09  <kando>: while keeping faithful
03:42:14  <Zhs2>: They could hand us the fraking source code
03:42:22  <kando>: for FREE i mean shit what more could they ask for
03:42:24  <Zhs2>: frak that documentation shit
03:42:26  <Zhs2>: haha
03:42:28  <kando>: except to share what they've done
03:42:30  <kando>: with the world
03:42:42  <kando>: well those didnt link right
03:42:45  <kando>: but u get te drift
03:43:00  <Zhs2>: I would be surprised if they still had Super Metroid's source code
03:43:11  <kando>: im sure its on a floppy drive somewhere
03:43:15  <Sadiztyk>: they probably do in an archive somewhere
03:43:18  <kando>: in eeprom file format
03:43:19  <Sadiztyk>: lol floppy
03:43:23  <Zhs2>: Hard drive crash; gone forever
03:43:33  <Zhs2>: All of the floppies were touched by fingers
03:43:38  <kando>: brb
03:43:41  <Zhs2>: lol
03:43:44  <interdpth>: I heard Nintedo has a warehouse
03:43:46  <interdpth>: For all it's source
03:43:48  <DChronos>: They probably just have the original chips

I left in all the random crap that may have come up though
[/spoiler]


Personally, I don't see why Nintendo shouldn't at least give it a try. We're creating hacks for people to play, giving them to Nintendo FOR FREE, with which they can sell on VC. It would certainly boost the hacking community when people see what can be done, as well as revive Nintendo's older games. It's a win-win situation! =)

What do you guys/girls think about this idea?

[FullOfFail]

Err, seems like alot of legal trouble. I don't even know if we're supposed to be doing this in the first place. Also, I think Nintendo makes money off the VC so how would that work for the hackers? A percentage? None? I think it's a good idea, but I don't think Nintendo would do it.

[begrimed]

Hah, so my pipe dreaming spawned a topic of interest? Neat-o. I can't imagine too much how it would work. Legality could maybe be discussed if we got in touch with the right person/people from Nintendo. Not immediately going for the higher-ups, but talking to someone who could give the idea some thought and help us turn it into something presentable before the whole idea is 'pitched.' I don't think an email to random Nintendo execs that say "hey we edit metroid you should sell them on vc" will fly too well. We need to work out something more than that and do the planning ahead for them so they know we've got confidence in the idea and are serious in pursuing it.

Right now, the only hack I could think of to show Nintendo as a way of saying "we ARE capable of this" is Redesign. Hacks with overhauled GFX and palettes are great, but few are as perfected and polished as Redesign is as a complete and functional game that could be played by a large number of people without significant game-breaking. It's been a long time since I played it, so I don't remember how difficult it is in terms of how much you need to know about the original game to complete it, but hard hacks are a definite no-no in my opinion. Bear in mind a lot of people who play them might be younger too, the games need to really grab that essence of Super Metroid, but deviate enough to feel like a new title made by the official developers.

And that's all I can think of to say right now. I'd really like to see this go somewhere, myself.

[squishy_ichigo]

My biggest concern would be if they decide to C&D us if we were to ask them.  I enjoy doing this to much to see it all taken away from us.

With how many Nintendo games that are hacked though, they must know that we do it.  Maybe they don't care enough to C&D us...

[FullOfFail]

Yeah, that's one of my concerns too Squishy. I mean, Nintendo is a company, companies don't like competition. I remember Dman throwing around the idea of making a cartridge, that seems more plausible to me.

[devonodev]

As cool as it would be for Nintendo to sell our hacks on VC, I doubt it would ever happen.
If you really wanted to, you can inject roms into VC games.. although it's not quite the same.

[begrimed]

Nintendo can't not be aware of ROM hacking with all of the Mario World hack videos on YouTube. They're a big company. I'm sure there are several who at least know what ROM hacking is.

[squishy_ichigo]

can't not

<_<;

[personitis]

It would certainly boost the hacking community when people see what can be done, as well as revive Nintendo's older games. It's a win-win situation! =)

I'm going to have to differ on this statement. Though yes, it would most likely boost the hacking community, there would be a few other things to happen as well. First of all (like others said) I could defiantly a C&D order coming... not to fond of that one. Second, they'd probably reject because it's like asking them to use pirated material (or something). Technically, whether you own the original game or not, it's still illegal to have possession of a ROM on your computer (for a time it was legal... until some idiot blew his chance on something. I don't exactly remember the whole legal story). Third and final, Nintendo would probably just say no and instead steal our ideas (and maybe our hacks) because in all technicality, our hacks are still their work. You can't really go to court on that one as there's to much against you there.

The thought, interesting and cool. The possibility: never gonna happen. Sorry to be so pessimistic.

[begrimed]

That's what stops a lot of ideas in their tracks, though. It's easy to just brush off the possibility because it could be considered pirated and whatnot, but in a different context, you could look at it like remixing music or something. We'd just need a chance to explain our whole side and make known the fact that the 'pirating' of Super Metroid is a necessary and minor evil in the bigger picture of things.

I'm not comlpetely optimistic on it myself because it's indeed such a long shot, BUT, I still think a modicum of a chance for success exists if we managed to get the attention of a down-to-Earth, knowledgable Nintendo employee who could see things from our perspective and analyze whether it's a worthy-enough venture to chase.

When I try to look at it from Nintendo's side, all I see is a win/win. We'd basically be offering ourselves as a free or dirt-cheap DEVELOPMENT TEAM for them. If things managed to get anywhere, they could include short demos of the hack(s) with newer Wii games (like Brawl did with Super Metroid and some other games) and maybe give our efforts a plug in Nintendo Power somewhere to generate a more wide-spread interest or something.

I can see it working out, but I can also see it failing miserably. Won't find out if we don't make a move sooner or later. We could be left kicking ourselves in the anus if another hacking community managed to do the same thing later on down the road. I'm looking at Mario World since it's so widely hacked - and I can't be the only one who's thought of this. We need to beat them to the punch, bros.

[FullOfFail]

I mean, I guess it's worth a shot. We do this for free, so we shouldn't really run into any legal problems in that aspect. The worse that can really happen is them trying to shut us down and us going underground. I wouldn't even know who to ask though. You'd need to find the chain of command. I can't even begone to imagine the pure gold this community would make if you all worked in unison, squishy, sadistik and DSO on asmz, Dman, black falcon, and grime on aesthetics, GF on the graphics, WOW!!! *explodes*

[interdpth]

IIRC a person from Nintendo said he see's ROM hacks as just fanart and loves them as long as someone isn't trying to profit from them.

[personitis]

IIRC a person from Nintendo said he see's ROM hacks as just fanart and loves them as long as someone isn't trying to profit from them.

Link if you can please. Sounds like an interesting read.

And I just want to throw this out there on a more humorous note: what are we gonna do if they ask for a hack so big that the community has to pitch in! :whoa: As we all know, those don't get done...

* person701 looks at SMP...

Shaddup, it's been on the back burner for a looooong time. :>_>:

[squishy_ichigo]

That is another matter altogether. A request like that would make more people willing to come together to work on something.

[MetroidMst]

I would only do it if we are given an office building so we can all meet and work together there so we can keep tabs on everything easier. Plus free coffee, lots of ingrediants to make my own food (And a subway nearby.), plus my own office so I can get away from lazy hackers and all the inevitable young ladies who would invariably come rushing to take their photo with me. (And who knows what else!)

I like to idea of hacks being avaiblable on VC, but not sold on the idea that it could be pitched to Nintendo to get them to do it. But I shure would love to see it done. I think it would be awesome to see Fear on VC and see how many times people have downloaded it. I may not need paid after seeing something like that.

[Lunaria]

IIRC Drew tried to do with this redesign back when VC first came out... :/

[personitis]

IIRC Drew tried to do with this redesign back when VC first came out... :/

Uhh, all I know is that he mentioned if Nintendo would put it on VC "that'd be great." I think I know what video you saw?

[Lunaria]

This was a IRC convo a few years back... :/

[RealRed]

                                                 ... :/

[gunnargumpert]

i like the idea!!!!


REDESIGN FOR WII? DREWSEPH WOULD BECOME FAMOUSE at the whole planet^^


and the other hacks, too

let´s go and show nintendo our ass!!!

i like it realy!

[squishy_ichigo]

totally necro'd this topic... nice gunnar.

Well, it gives me an excuse to do something I've been waiting to do all month!

THIS TOPIC HAS OFFICIALLY BEEN MAGIKARP'D!

[gunnargumpert]

totally necro'd this topic... nice gunnar.

Well, it gives me an excuse to do something I've been waiting to do all month!

THIS TOPIC HAS OFFICIALLY BEEN MAGIKARP'D!

what? i don´t understand what you mean!

[Parabox]

It means he used Splash.  A move that does nothing.

[Antidote]

lock this, let it rot.

[RealRed]

 :mad:

Antidote: No lock begging... I didn't even know this was here <_<