[SM] Z-Factor Hack v1.3

[Prime Hunter]

From where I am now I can see how some of these sequence breaks would've been possible, but apparently I'm following the intended route (the one Zhs2 posted on the 1st page) and I'm having a heck of a time making progress. I feel like the main path is hidden a little too well most of the time. (Granted, I am still using 1.0 right now) I've been able to make my way to the Power Bombs using a lot of the hints that have been left in the topic so far, but with each new item I'm feeling my excitement for this fading away. This kind of exploration is the worst in my opinion because it turns into blind guessing and that's not very intuitive for me. I think I know how to get somewhere based on the map but then I get there and it leads to a dead end or a path I can't progress through unless I have the item I'm heading towards, which gets frustrating real quick.

I'm still going to play this one to the end if I can since there are some interesting ideas here and there, but so far I'm not enjoying this as much as I would've liked to.

[Zhs2]

I'll continue to update the post as I find major items. Maridia is one heck of a maze.

[MetroidMst]

I'll continue to update the post as I find major items. Maridia The hack is one heck of a maze.

Searching for Gravity myself now. Spent some time yesterday looking around aimlessly some more, missed an obvious plant, found said plant and have finally defeated two major bosses. Had to stop for a sleep, and now, back to finding some Gravity.

I guess it makes sense that Maridia would be a huge maze. The hack is pretty much like that anyway, and most hacks that use Maridia turn it into the torturous maze area of their hack for some reason. I guess I will find out how much that is true a little later on.

[Prime Hunter]

I've gotten up to grapple now and just entered the Wrecked Ship. My earlier concerns still apply for the most part, although I'm starting to wonder if I'm getting used to how this hack works because some of the more hidden paths are becoming apparent to me now. That said, I only found grapple through dumb luck (same with charge earlier) because I happened to wall jump up and around the room its in and come at it from above.

[spoiler]Bombing out that wall, something you'd only be able to reach by wall jumping, grappling, or freezing the bugs as they climbed the left side of that shaft, falls under the "would have never thought to do that/go there" category. There's been way too many of those moments up to this point.[/spoiler]

[Metaquarius]

I'm still going to play this one to the end if I can since there are some interesting ideas here and there, but so far I'm not enjoying this as much as I would've liked to.

Sad to hear that, but I guess that's all my fault to have made the first half of the hack too complicated.
Funny to see how I thought it was not hard, and it was in fact...

More updates might be required to fix the overall difficulty, so far, I'm waiting for feedback on Maridia. Good luck everyone.

[Digital_Mantra]

I've been circling maridia with gravity for over 2 hours now trying to find plasma.
All I'm finding is lots of secrets which make me hopeful, but end up just being missiles or dead ends.
Some of your hidden paths are bullshit, infact, this maridia is bullshit. <still looks really nice tho.

edit: [spoiler][/spoiler]
what next. what region. maridia wants plasma to progress, or space jump, i duno.

[Prime Hunter]

I'm down in Maridia now myself after figuring out how to get by one spot in the WS that was driving me bonkers. Have to thank Zhs2 for giving me a moment of inspiration in his hint for the Gravity Suit, because otherwise I'd still be at the beginning of the WS in what is otherwise a point of no return if you can't figure out how to get to a certain door. I will say this though, the rest of the Wrecked Ship is pretty straightforward in its design compared to Brinstar and Norfair, which was a much needed breath of fresh air for me after all of the trouble I've had so far. Judging from what DMantra just said though I'm not hopeful about the rest of Maridia.

My progress seems to follow a pattern of getting to one point in the game, circling for ages finding locked doors or other barriers (and the occasional expansion) only to stumble across the correct path at random or have someone's comments here give me an idea of what direction I should be headed in. The fact that this has happened quite often, not just with the major items but with paths that unlock entire sections of the map, is what is killing my enjoyment. I think if general navigation was cleaned up a bit and there were some more hints in general, both of which sound like they're already getting looked at based on v1.1's patch, most of my complaints would cease.

[Quote58]

this maridia is bullshit. <still looks really nice tho.

I agree completely with that statement.
Lower norfair isn't quite such bullshit, but it's still annoying. However, I like being here without going through a ton of maridia shit.
[spoiler]And skrew attack is a nice bonus. loved the room of fake chozo balls before it[/spoiler]

[Scyzer]

5:32. 72%
The escape was hard. Not because of the design, but the time limit. You need to be pretty much flawless (not TAS, but NO mistakes) just to be able to make it back to the ship. I dont see how it's possible to also free the animals without TAS.

[Digital_Mantra]

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Is this a troll room?

[Metaquarius]

what next. what region. maridia wants plasma to progress, or space jump, i duno.

Your next goal is to track down Botwoon. First you must find a way to reach the top middle rooms in Maridia that should be visible on the region map. Actually, there's two ways to get up there.

5:32. 72%
The escape was hard. Not because of the design, but the time limit. You need to be pretty much flawless (not TAS, but NO mistakes) just to be able to make it back to the ship. I dont see how it's possible to also free the animals without TAS.

Hint : There're speedbooster shorcuts in Tourian, you might want to use them to save the animals.

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Is this a troll room?

Yes. There's a fake wall somewhere before this point.

[MetroidMst]

Time 13:23 or something
81% Item collection.

Alright, there is a lot to be said about this hack. (Which I say a lot during the marathon recording sessions, but I digress...) What I will say first is. Well done! For a first hack, this is extremely impressive, and all the little ASM touches were nicely added and used. I am very impressed with the hack in whole, but there are a few very glaring problems with it.

[spoiler=Thoughts]First and foremost, that time. 13 hours + is an awful time. Most of that was spent between Maridia and Norfair, with a good amount of Brinstar thrown in. Some of that was my fault, I went around and explored a lot, but I was exploring because I didn't really have a clue where to go. The main path really needed to stand out more. While the puzzle of finding where to go isn't a bad thing, it was just used so much in this hack that it cast a shadow over all the good stuff.

What this hack really needs, is an obvious path for the player. Remember, you made the hack, so you route will be obvious to you. Everyone else won't have a clue. You could've left Maridia alone and make the rest fairly straightforward to get through, and it would've been way better. (Though people would still loathe Maridia with a passion.)

When I was progressing, the hack felt great. It was wonderful to play for the most part, and offered up something completely new. The changes you made were for the most part pretty epic. For a first hack, the stuff in here is truly spectacular. It is the sort of stuff I expect from Black_Falcon or DSO. But again, I was rarely on the right path and was often stuck trying to do something stupid, because I thought that was what was required of me to advance.

So in the end, the hack was fun. I really did like it, excluding Maridia where I started to lose my mind, and there was a bunch of rad stuff going on. I certainly hope to see more from you in the future, and perhaps next time you will make a clearer path for us mortals.[/spoiler]

I would like to recommend the hack, but I have to put a caution on it. I enjoyed it mostly, and there are some truly good things in it, but it will test players patience out. There isn't a clear path, there are a lot of miniscule little things you have to find to advance, and some truly painful parts. So fair warning, this won't be a pick-up-and-play type of hack. This will take some dedication to finish. (Though that will let players see the best Tourian ever.)

Also, this hack is not "about the same difficulty" as the original Super. This hack is much harder. Needed to mention that.

NOTE: I played entirely on 1.0 edition and have not looked into 1.1 or any other versions as of this post.

[Digital_Mantra]

so yeah, was just entering tourian, feelin' great with the progress and stuff and this happens.

[Prime Hunter]

Yikes! So much for "best Tourian ever" huh? I wonder what could've screwed that up for you when a few people have managed to finish this now.

I think it's time to ask for a hint. Which side of Maridia are you supposed to be on to make progress when you come back with the Gravity Suit? From what I can tell there's only 3 ways to go on either side, 2 of which are blocked by grey doors and the other has some speed booster blocks that I can't figure out how to break. (In the room you eventually come to when you drop down the left sand pit from the top entrance near Kraid's area.)

[Digital_Mantra]

Yikes! So much for "best Tourian ever" huh? I wonder what could've screwed that up for you when a few people have managed to finish this now.

No idea, it's as if the entire tileset is overwritten or something. Or maybe I'm posting the worst bug yet during this community beta-test.
Odd considering some have beating v1.0. I didn't invest 3 days and nights of exploration hell to wind up with a fucking bug like this.
Not happy..

I think it's time to ask for a hint. Which side of Maridia are you supposed to be on to make progress when you come back with the Gravity Suit?

This was a bitch for me to find, and one reason people hated Zaridia so much. (lol get it?).
You gotta find botwoon, but like most important places to progress in this hack, he's well hidden.
Apparently I passed the hint to his room several times during the Z-Roudabouts. I had to beg on irc for a clue.
Once I found out, I was ready to flip my desk over. Good luck.
(btw telling you a general direction wouldn't really help. I'd have to see a map of what you've explored)


Anyways, Metaquarius.. you're going to fix this bug, I got saves outside of Tourian and I AM beating this god damn game..

[Metaquarius]

I think it's time to ask for a hint. Which side of Maridia are you supposed to be on to make progress when you come back with the Gravity Suit? From what I can tell there's only 3 ways to go on either side, 2 of which are blocked by grey doors and the other has some speed booster blocks that I can't figure out how to break. (In the room you eventually come to when you drop down the left sand pit from the top entrance near Kraid's area.)

Intended path : Take the Wrecked Ship elevator to West Maridia and find the entrance of a turbo pipe (whatever its called)
Alternate path : Cross the sandfall room on the left of the map station in East Maridia.

so yeah, was just entering tourian, feelin' great with the progress and stuff and this happens.

Dunno what's going on there. Are you still using 1.0 ? Can you send me your save file (srm) ?

Thank you for playing, MetroidMst.  :^_^:

[Zhs2]

Apparently DMantra's problem occurs in Tourian if you're using SNES9x 1.43, so far. Scyzer and MetroidMst have beaten the game no problem. The hack author himself uses ZSNES and I know Scyzer played it in SNES9x 1.51.

[Prime Hunter]

Intended path : Take the Wrecked Ship elevator to West Maridia and find the entrance of a turbo pipe (whatever its called)
Alternate path : Cross the sandfall room on the left of the map station in East Maridia.

:<_<: Now I know how DMantra feels. I went back and found the hidden passage in West Maridia almost immediately. I knew there was something up with that wall, but I didn't investigate it enough. It didn't hurt that I hadn't found the map station until just recently either so there was a huge blank spot in the middle of the two sections and no map hints I could count on.

Thanks for the tips guys! Now I get to run around for ages in Maridia, which looks terribly daunting...

[MetroidMst]

Thanks for the tips guys! Now I get to run around for ages in Maridia, which looks terribly daunting...

You poor, poor soul. Prepare to lose your mind within the bowels of... ZARIDIA!

Seriously, Zaridia almost made me lose my mind.

[Digital_Mantra]

16:14 / 88%

Ok, so you've heard my complaints and praise.
This hack is a solid 10 out of 10 if issues are addressed.

Thanks for making one of the greatest hacks out there.
See you next mission!

[Riffman81]

Apparently DMantra's problem occurs in Tourian if you're using SNES9x 1.43, so far. Scyzer and MetroidMst have beaten the game no problem. The hack author himself uses ZSNES and I know Scyzer played it in SNES9x 1.51.

Just wanted to mention that I'm using the latest development build of SNES9x (12092012) and have come across no problems like DMantra's. So far the only issues I'm having are just figuring out where to go next... but that's part of the fun, right?  :^_^: However, I agree with some of the others... the intended path is not obvious...

I'm still playing 1.0 I'll download the new patch later tonight and post again when I finished playing... or if I find something useful to share.

[Prime Hunter]

And now I completely understand the Zaridia hatred. :evilno: You can add me to that list.

I think I know where Botwoon might be at this point, but it's getting there that's the problem. I've found one definite permastuck location, one possible one, and one set of speed booster blocks that if what I did was the intended method of breaking them should not exist... ever.
[spoiler]I charged up a shinespark in the room above the "Turbo Pipe", fell through the pipe, and used way too many save states in the room below to pull off a mid-air horizontal shinespark right as the charge burned out. For more clariry, it's two rooms to or so to the east of that troll room DMantra posted earlier with the Oum in it. All that for a super missile and a troll room? You can imagine I wasn't very pleased when I found that out. I'll feel even better if I find out there was a much easier way to break those that I somehow missed as I scanned all of the nearby rooms for a place to charge up the shinespark.[/spoiler]

Definite Permastuck:[spoiler]I was using grapple to break the blocks in the floor and got pushed backward into the pipes. The bomb in the 2nd picture shows my location inside the wall.



[/spoiler]

Possible Permastuck: [spoiler]I was going through this room and found the morph ball passage on the bottom, but because I was going slow the gates fell and trapped me in the middle. I tried going back through the morph ball passage but I couldn't seem to get out. I'm not sure if I missed something here or not but since I can't check SMILE and I don't have X-Ray I can't do much.



[/spoiler]

I know exactly how DMantra felt after that Tourian issue. I've come to far to quit now.

[MetroidMst]

And Zaridia claims another victim... Getting to Botwoon is indeed a problem. Took us a very long time. There are more than one Maridian turbo tubes in Zaridia...

[spoiler=Hint]In one of these tubes you will find nothing but sand on the floor and a locked door. Fall down the sand.[/spoiler]

The hard part is finding out the rest of the plaze you haven't explored, and thanks to more tubes, they may not be right next to where you think they should be.

[Prime Hunter]

I finally found Botwoon, who was annoying because of his room but I got past him after a try or two. Didn't seem to get anything for defeating him though (hope I didn't miss the item), plus the two doors I was hoping would unlock in west Zaridia so I could get to Draygon remain shut. The best part is they block the only blue places left on my map, so either I forgot about a door somewhere in there or there's yet another path I haven't discovered yet!

[MetroidMst]

After Botwoon is defeated, you are maybe 5-6 rooms from Draygon. He seriously leads you right to him.